Jim Rauch Interview Transcription

Part 11: That Pot Shit
(in which Jim rambles on interminably about nothing in particular. I don't have much to say about this part. The detectives aren't here to care about your relationship problems, Jim...)

(Jim) Y'know, I've had my drinks, and... done that share of that shit... I was a professional musician for years and years and never did drugs, and (unintelligible).

(Nitschke) Never did drugs, or any of that?

(Jim) Well, about the only time I... (unintelligible) experience... I'll share it... (chuckles) okay, I'll share it... It was with my ex-wife. We were, we were, I guess we were like, I don't know, three or four married - three, three or four years married? We had a thirty year marriage. And she was.. (unintelligible) "I wanna try that pot shit."

(Nitschke) (chuckles)

(Jim) So, so, so I made arrangements to get this pot from somebody, I don't know who it was. And uh, we had rolled these, these little, little cigarettes, and I uh, (mimes smoking a J) didn't feel a fucking thing. Right? She took a one, one, one draw of this - and she got deathly sick! (chuckles) I mean, I mean DEATHLY sick!

(Nitschke) Deathly sick?

(Jim) I'm, I'm, (unintelligible) tellin' wh - at the end of the whole evening, I had called the doctor, sh - I had taken her to the hospital! (Laughs gleefully)

(Nitschke) So you had a whole night of just... her idea...

(Jim) (still laughing) Oh god it was (unintelligible) And, wh- and, and that was the wh - One of the only two times I - The other time was um, I was playing a New Year's Eve job in, uh, Ashland. Kentucky, and, um... the snow was really bad, and I had, had helped move some equipment and stuff. And I pulled my back, and they took me to the hospital. And they gave me a damn shot of, of... morphine. At that time, in Ashland. I couldn't sit up at the piano! (mimes piano playing) I play key - I swear, I couldn't play. I couldn't... I couldn't play worth shit! They had hired.. you know, they had hired me for a hundred dollars for that night, I couldn't... That's my, that's my, drug, heh!... thing. Not.... I, I, I drink vodka... I drink, I drink, I drink a lot of different things, but, uh... Probably a couple of drinks a night.

(Nitschke) Couple drinks a night? You said tonight, you said you just had a couple drinks...

(Jim) Yeah, uh...

(Nitschke) A couple vodka tonics, I think you said?

(Jim) Yeah, I go, I usually come home, take a couple, take a couple drinks, just relax, and, um, that does it...
(yeah, sure. a "couple")

(Nitschke) You get home, kinda relax a bit?

(Jim) I do at home, I, I do, and, until I get a phone call that says, "hey, wanna come over?" shh. I'm sorry.

(Nitschke) Jim, we're just talking here. That's... that's the main thing. You know? Uhh...

(Jim) I've really have not done anything wrong here, except for, uh, following up on something that somebody else has... provoked me to...

(Nitschke) Yeah...

(Jim) And, um... (makes weird karate chop gesture)

(Nitschke) And it's like, like we talked about... you just...

(Jim) I just cut it off.

(Nitschke) You had a thing... you felt a connection... you felt a need to help her...

(Jim) Yeah, but the thing is.. it isn't a real person... so what I did was... I cut it off... which is like my... operandi, anyway... which is I cut people off from, from really knowing me, which is probably more detrimental than...

(Nitschke) How often do you do that? Just... every so often, or any time you get close to somebody, or...?

(Jim) (chuckles ruefully) I have somebody who's really close to me right now, who... if she would come close to me, it would be my, my, in my opinion, euphoria. Euphoria. There are other people that I could... I was dating a couple, on, like... oh, I don't know... five people, maybe? One person up in Wilmington, one person in Dayton... All, all online... and all legitimate, and all real people, and I said... well, the real person I wanna be with is right here. And so I sent these emails to these other ones and said, I'm, I'm sorry, I'm gonna have to stop seeing you... I really wanna see this one person, and... (long pause) She doesn't understand. That's hard... um, that's hard...

(Nitschke) It is hard.

(Jim) Um... mainly because I know that she's the right person? I mean, God, um... I was married for thirty years and it was the WRONG person... Um.. and I've known this person for probably ten to fifteen years.

(Nitschke) Somebody you work with, or?

(Jim) No, actually not... It's somebody who I have had acquaintance with... and she's divorced, and everything's fine. And she's got older kids, and I've got older kids. She just, she just is so scared of... scared of... (morosely trails off)

(Knock at the door)

(Jim) (suddenly jovial) C'mon in!... You're the same person that left!

(Reid) Yeah! (to Nitschke) Can I have that chat for a minute...
(a frown crosses Jim's face. Here he seems to begin to realize the depth of trouble he's in.)

(Reid) I'm gonna run a copy of it so we have some (unintelligible) to look at...

(Nitschke) Okay.

(Jim) Actually she, the person I'm talking about is, um... again, you can take it for whatever it's worth... she's... she's actually a social worker...

(Reid) Can I have that folder for a minute?

(Jim) You have a nice...

(Reid) I'm sorry, I'm sorry to interrupt you guys... I know you're chattin'...

(Jim) No, it's all right, don't - do, do your thing, do, do what you have to do...

(Reid) And I'll be right back... (door shuts)

(Jim) She's actually a social worker with... sexual abuse... and she.. she knows exactly what you guys are doing. Except for on, on a, on a... (long pause) medical... aspect... instead of a legal...
(this is probably a conversational land mine you shouldn't have stepped on...)

(Nitschke) Okay, she kinda helps... helps people out, who...?

(Jim) Uh, basically, she's.... she's now a supervisor... she's working... she's working for... job... over, over in Ohio... um... all the ones with the Marcus White...

(Nitschke) Faisel? (sp?)

(Jim) Job in... job in... I can't remem... the agency... Part of the state of Ohio.

(Nitschke) Oh, okay.

(Jim) Anyway. So she's working with them, she's working as a supervisor, she works with, she works with the... um... basically, um... um... physical abuse. She used to work with sexual abuse. God... day in and day out...

(Nitschke) Yeah, it's hard.

(Jim) Oh god, it's horrible. (Jim looks a bit dyspeptic here, like he's going to barf) I would see her... two, three times a week? And every time she'd come... come with another story of some, some, some (unintelligible)... doin' some... crap... But now she's involved, she's a supervisor, but she's a supervisor over, over this PHYSICAL abuse. I don't know if it's any worse, or better. I know she (unintelligible) three times a week, she's got some kid who's been killed by the parents!

(Nitschke) It's overwhelming.

(Jim) It is... it is... it really is... and I sympathize with that. But, that, that goes along with my feelings here, too. Because, um, I respect what she does, and I (unintelligible) kind of like, (deep sigh) I wish you would just reach a point where you're happy with dealing with that... go to sleep at night, knowing that you've done the right decision.

(Nitschke) Yeah.

(Jim) Um... um... But it's hard... it's very hard... And the divorce was hard... her and her husband... her ex-husband... My divorce wasn't as.. well, I SAY that... two weeks ago was the first, the first time my ex-wife and I, after four years, were able to sit in the same room.

(Nitschke) Really. That bad?

(Jim) Yeah. And it wasn't me, it was her. She couldn't - she couldn't, couldn't, couldn't, couldn't do it. So... And then add THIS onto it, God... (Laughs) Let's put it, let's add it up on the! (mimes a long list of grievances)

(Nitschke) What made you guys separate, or leave each other?

(Jim) Well, uh, um, to be perfectly honest, I, the woman I was talking about, who had... I... She wasn't comm... totally committed to me, but I had, had, had a relationship with her, and... um... um... her husband was a judge! (unintelligible) go there... uh, but, um, he has made it absolutely miserable for her to move on... And I don't know, we connected, at, at, actually we connected at church. We were... I was an organist, she was a piano player for one of the groups, and we grew.. Uh, ehh, we, uhh, and I knew her kids, and ehh, umm, ahh, it was really, it was really healthy. It was really healthy, except for the fact that he really didn't want it to happen. He didn't know what to do when he lost.. he lost his... (with effort) he lost his control. But the thing is over the years, I've been trying to recoup that. And, and she's got her independence, to the point where... I... there's not a control issue anymore, well, there is, but it's a control issue on HER part... I could care less... c'mon... you know? I love you. It's, it's, it's, we could have a great life together... I want my independence. I can deal with it.

(Nitschke) Sounds like you made peace with it.
(sounds like maybe she's not that into you?)

Part 13: What You Guys Do
(In which Jim tries to sell the detectives on UC's online Masters program)

(Reid) Want me to read it for you...

(Nitschke) See if I can do this...

(Reid) Okay.

(Jim) So have either of you taken the Master's Degree Online program at UC? (broad smile)

(Reid) Noooo... Have you set it - did you set it up?

(Jim) I have been there since the very beginning of it. And it, uhh... it works... I'm, I'm. I'm pretty much involved with it.

(Reid) Yeah. The mechanics of it, online?

(Jim) Mmm-hmm. I do the delivery part of it.

(Reid) Mmm-hmm.

(Jim) Uhh... and they've got top-notch people running the program.

(Reid) Yeah. Have to look into it...

(Jim) It's about $2,000... a quarter... but you can, you can complete it in two years. Master's degree.

(Reid) Really. Who... who accredited them?

(Jim) Um... (licks lips) It's accredited by... by... (mumbles incoherently) It's accredited by the people who accredit university education department... um... you can give 'em a call, I don't... um... the, because there's no accreditation department for criminal justice, at this point, in the state of Ohio. I don't know there, if in Kentucky there is or not. But in the state of Ohio there isn't. Um, but... um... (unintelligible)

(Reid) I appreciate that. I have to look at it and see.

(Jim) Well, if you're looking for a master's degree, it's an easy way to go. Um... course work isn't too bad... lotta reading...

(Reid) Yeah. So...

(Jim) I work with....

(Reid) Go ahead.

(Jim) I work with all the professors that do the delivery. And so whatever tasks they want... what kind of, of, of... we call 'em modules... there's five modules, every course is a five week course. And it's, again, it's... (long pause, looks like he's going to barf again) just off the top of my head, about $2000 per quarter (burp)... so if you're talkin'... uh, two years, you're talkin'... 16 quar... 16 quarters? That's about thirty... thousand dollars. Um, but it gets you a master's degree in criminal justice, it's a master's degree in science - master of science degrees - (licks lips) try that again: (says each word with effort) master of science degree in criminal justice from.. one of the top, top , criminal justice, um... programs in the, the, um, country.

(Reid) Mmm-hmm.

(Jim) Right now UC's number five... in the country... and, um, these are, these are top-notch people - the prof - the actual professors do look at stuff. I don't know if you know any of their names or anything... of your...

(Reid) No, no.

(Jim) But they're the people that are changing what... what happens. What you guys do day in and day and out.

(Reid) Yeah. Has their program been really successful? The online...

(Jim) Yes, the online program... we, we started, uh, five years ago, with fifteen students. We now have over 600.

(Reid) Wow. That's phenomenal growth.

(JIm) And, um, well, and, yeah, uh, and it brings in about two million dollars a year... Profit.

(Reid) Mmm-hmm.

(Jim) Okay. What am I signing? (he stands up and waddles out of frame to sign papers)

(Nitschke) Okay, we'll do this first one here: This is for your vehicle, located at Highland Heights Police Department, Highland Heights, Kentucky, 4-10-76, and more particularly described as a 2003 Pontiac Aztek, Ohio plate DG73LC, and your VIN number, all that...

(Jim) As if I'd remember that.

(Nitschke) Yeah well most people, some people know... I grant this consent to Tom Nitschke, which is me, known to me as a... (points to form) I had to, I marked that, as a detective with the Campbell County Police Department, and to such other officers deemed necessary to assist. And that I had the right to refuse to consent, and I voluntarily give up that right, I note that the agent does not have to have a search warrant, I'll put... (marks paper)

(Jim) You wanna search the fuckin' car. (laughs)

(Nitschke) Haha, well, uh...

(Jim) Yeah, you need to, right?

(Nitschke) I, uh, uh, have not been threatened or coerced in any way, and I have not been promised any favor or...

(Jim) Is that what (unintelligible) I just did there? (laughs more)

(Nitschke) Heh, and I, uh, have read this consent form , or it has been read to me, and I understand it.

(Jim) I understand it.

(Nitschke) Today is, and I need you to sign your name there (indicates), print it, and put your address, and I'll sign as witness.

(Jim) (scrawls signature, then prints details with effort) It's a good thing you asked me to print it.

(Reid) Yeah, I don't think we could have made much out of the signature.

(Jim) But that is my real signature.

(Reid) Yeah.

(Jim mumbles something, then finishes signing.)

(Nitschke) And I'll witness it here... (he signs paper)... just one other piece of housekeeping here...

(Jim sits back in the chair, sighs, blows a raspberry)

(Jim) Are you ready?

(Nitschke) Yeah. (Jim begins to stand up) No, no, no, you have a seat. Only other thing is, I know said you have nothing in your house. Do you have anything inside your residence, on...

(Jim) Brandy Way.

(Nitschke) On Brandy Way. Is there anything in there, to... would give us any concern? You said...

(Jim) You... you have... the only thing that you, you, would have, would be the computer things, but you have all the references to that... um...

(Nitschke) Got a problem with anybody looking in there, to make sure there's not another... nothin' of...?

(Jim) Unless they want to see my genitalia. (laughs) I'm sorry. (to Reid) That was a joke.

(Nitschke) Well, would you.. haha... caught me off guard there, Jim...

(Reid) (laughs) It's late.

(Jim) Nooo, there's nothing on there. I don't keep pornography on there (slaps wall absently), and I don't distribute pornography, if somebody wants to go in there, and, and, go through and find a, uh, uh, some sort of program that I have um... (looks up at ceiling) say, um, um...

(Nitschke) There's no kiddy porn, or anything like that?

(Jim) No, no, no.

(Nitschke) And, all, all that I'm gonna find is some adult stuff?

(Jim) No, no I'm not even talking about that stuff. I'm talking about if somebody goes in, they find a piece of software that I, I, uh, that I have... (makes goofy face)

(Reid) Oh, like warez... (she pronounces it war-ezz)

(Jim) From somebody else, that, that, that, there might be something like that. But I don't, but I, no, I don't do that. I'm... Go in.

(Nitschke) You have no problem with that?

(Jim) No.

(Nitschke) Okay. Well, what I'll do, I'll do another consent, if you don't have a problem with that...

(Jim) Okay. But, does that mean they come in and take my computers away? And, and, and, and re- cause me a problem not to be able to work?

(Reid) Ummmm...

(Nitschke) Well that could be an issue.

(Reid) Yeah.

(Nitschke) I mean I'll see if there's... information... I mean, if they deem it, if it feels like it could have some information that they may need, y'know, that is... a possibility.

(Jim) Okay, so, so... so gimme some help here.

(Nitschke) I can't tell you what to do. It's up to you. How you... I mean...

(Reid) Yeah.

(Jim) I don't wanna seem like I'm not cooperative, because I really am cooperative, because I really don't have the kiddy porn shit on there. If they wanna do that.

(Reid) Right...

(Jim) If there's kiddy porn shit on there, somebody else has put it on there... (Uh-oh. -Ed.) from... some... site, or some... But, in the same regard, I need to be able to use my computer.

(Nitschke) Okay...

(Reid) Yeah...

(Jim) So...

(Nitschke) Well, it's up to you - if, if, if you wanna consent or not. I'm - I'm leaving that up to you.

(Reid) Yeah, we can't make you any promises on how quickly you would get it back.

(Jim) But, but, what if I don't sign? What happens if I don't sign?

(Reid) (long pause) Then you don't sign it.

(Nitschke) You don't sign it. That's...

(Reid) Okay. It's completely your call.

(Jim) Okay. O-o-o-only because, okay, but, in lieu of the conversation that you just - we just had, and (sticks out tongue) I'm not - I'm not blaming - I'm not putting you on the spot. But, but, that is my reasoning for doing that.

(Nitschke) Okay. That's fine.

(Jim) Only - I have to - I - I have to have access to my computer, I have to - in order to do my job.
(yeah, I don't think you're going to need to worry about that.)

(Reid) Yeah.

(Nitschke) Okay. I'm not gonna force you to, you know, sign anything that you don't feel you want to, and I understand your reasoning, that's fine. (Don't worry, Jim. They can get a warrant and seize them, no problem. -Ed.) Uh, (clicks tongue) and I'll just leave it at that. Uh, I think right now, I don't have anything else?

(Reid) You wanna do the statement? Have him write his own statement?

(Nitschke) Yeah.

(crosstalk, shuffling papers)

(Nitschke) Last thing here, I overlooked it here. Um. Would you be willing to write a written statement of what happened here tonight, or?

(Jim) Oh, well, uh, I'd eventually like to have one!

(Nitschke) No, would YOU like to WRITE a statement...

(Reid) Your own. Your own written statement...

(Jim) Oh, well, uh, it depends on what you're gonna come across it with. If you come off with, if you (unintelligible) so negative, that, that, I'm uh a pervert, and I went out and...

(Nitschke) No, this is from you. This is what... This is YOUR account of what happened.

(Jim) I, I, ah, um, what I'm sayin' is, um, I don't know what you have, (unintelligible)

(Nitschke) It's... it's...

(Reid) It's a blank statement!

(Nitschke) It's a voluntary statement... it's blank, uh, it just lets you know your rights...
(it takes a great deal of effort to explain this to Jim)

(Jim) I just.. uh, does... it lets you know your rights?

(Nitschke) It lets you know your rights.

(Jim) If I don't put anything, does that relinquish my rights?

(Nitschke) No, if you don't wanna - if you don't wanna write anything, you don't have to. It's totally voluntary. This is not something - I'm just giving you the opportunity

(Jim) I'm just - I'm just trying to be careful. You know, I know the legal systems, and how they screw around with you...
(Um, Jim? You just drunkenly confessed to everything on videotape. You're about an hour and a half late for "careful". -Ed.)

(Nitschke) That is - that's fine... I think that' s every - everything I have for right now, um... I guess what we'll do is, um... you'll go with another officer for right now, um...

(Reid) We gotta do citation, don't we?

(Nitschke) Yeah, that's a little bit of clerical -

(Reid) Just paperwork, so that whenever they get you there, they can process you quickly...

(finishing up their paperwork, crosstalk)

(Jim) Is there anything else I need to know about, before we -

(Reid) I'll hang here, until you get -

(Nitschke) No, as of right now, there's nothing I can really tell you right now. Other than, um...

(Jim) Do I just sit here?

(Reid) Yeah, you just hang tight, and I'll hang here with you until we get somebody in here.

(Jim) Okay. I'm gonna take a nap.

(Reid) Yeah. Tough night.

(Jim) No... I mean, I don't wanna go through this ever again, but... tough? (shakes head)

You’re awesome. Thank you for doing this.